tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post1805353112175868782..comments2024-03-28T11:51:19.078-07:00Comments on Caltrain HSR Compatibility Blog: Level Boarding: It's OfficialClemhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01374282217135682245noreply@blogger.comBlogger80125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-41172869437874620232015-09-25T13:32:49.803-07:002015-09-25T13:32:49.803-07:00It's all politics. Caltrain has been planning ...It's all politics. Caltrain has been planning this since 1991. Then CAHSR came along in 2008, and gave them an opportunity to actually do it. More importantly, the areas Caltrain serves finally ran out of developable space so many of the cities on the route are now urbanizing. Caltrain holds all the cards for CAHSR, they have the only route into SF. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-28712040341038309582015-09-19T15:04:07.753-07:002015-09-19T15:04:07.753-07:00So Caltrain can have fully electric rail by 2021 b...So Caltrain can have fully electric rail by 2021 but GO Transit here in Ontario can't? This is just a crappy state of affairs.Lionel Braithwaitehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03024473793409118944noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-58860234709916205932015-09-06T18:10:36.445-07:002015-09-06T18:10:36.445-07:00While temporal separation was previously planned, ...While temporal separation was previously planned, FRA regulations will allow mixed traffic with alternate-compliant rolling stock.<br /><br />Also, as a point of order, UPRR loses money on the peninsula operations and couldn't care less about continued freight operations here. The freight customers (PFRUG) are the ones who would put up a fuss about abandonment.Clemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01374282217135682245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-6243534121159848912015-09-06T10:44:28.980-07:002015-09-06T10:44:28.980-07:00@Aarond: UP can and does regularly run trains in b...@Aarond: UP can and does regularly run trains in between Caltrain trains ... midday and early evenings (well before 10 pm).Reality Checkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06974156676436895262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-63902593290006820502015-09-06T09:09:05.415-07:002015-09-06T09:09:05.415-07:00@Jeff Carter
>However it is hypocritical to cl...@Jeff Carter<br /><br />>However it is hypocritical to claim we need compatibility and yet “disallow” conventional rail on the corridor.<br /><br />Conventional rail is allowed, just at night. Which is why Caltrain is not a 24/7 service, from 10pm-4am Union Pacific has the right to run trains. It would be impossible to disconnect Caltrain from the rest of the US's rail network when UP has trackage rights and would be able to get the STB involved. There *is* conventional rail on the corridor and always will be, but it'll be "temporally" separated to night hours. As for federal Amtrak, we will never ever see service on the Peninsula unless a heavy rail tube is built from Oakland to SF. The logistics/geography simply do not allow for it any other way.<br /><br />@Drunk Engineer<br /><br />If I remember correctly, that is partially why ACE is consolidating into CADOT (Amtrak California). CADOT is probably wrestling with this issue as we speak. In my opinion, it's not inconceivable that nu-ACE would use the same units as Caltrain (assuming their line is electrified as well during Phase II). Thus, CADOT would, over time, just use the same units as Caltrain as they phase out their fleets (which, given that they were built in '91, means they'll be replaced around 2030-50). I'm making a lot of assumptions here obviously, so if anyone has evidence that I am wrong I'd be happy to hear it.<br />Aarondnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-45190951028286025342015-09-05T00:26:05.681-07:002015-09-05T00:26:05.681-07:00What conventional rail? If you're talking abo...What conventional rail? If you're talking about the Coast Daylight, it has no place on the Peninsula. The mix of Caltrain locals, limiteds, and HSR will leave very little room in the schedule, and trains that are lucky to arrive within an hour of their scheduled time cannot be accommodated.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-86126125594249838612015-09-03T21:46:54.190-07:002015-09-03T21:46:54.190-07:00Surely you just keep your conventional height plat...Surely you just keep your conventional height platform at 4th and King for conventional railB.Dawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16024573324413713914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-8594991781136431152015-09-02T23:00:36.367-07:002015-09-02T23:00:36.367-07:00Mark is correct. Bare bones confirmation DTX FEIR...Mark is correct. Bare bones confirmation DTX FEIR Vol 1 Section 1.4.4<br /><br />"<i>Mission Bay is a 300-acre site located south and west of Pacific Bell Park (San Francisco Giants’ baseball stadium) and bounded by Townsend, Mariposa, and Seventh Streets, and China Basin that is being developed by Catellus Development Corporation. [...]<br /><br />"The JPB has a permanent surface easement on property within the Mission Bay project area that is currently used for railroad purposes.</i>"Richard Mlynarikhttp://www.pobox.com/users/mly/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-53464491034275549202015-09-02T19:24:50.424-07:002015-09-02T19:24:50.424-07:00@Mark, got a reference for that? It would be inte...@Mark, got a reference for that? It would be interesting to see.Reality Checkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06974156676436895262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-45492330924669253392015-09-02T18:06:36.534-07:002015-09-02T18:06:36.534-07:00Caltrain does not own the 4th and Townsend yard, C...Caltrain does not own the 4th and Townsend yard, Catellus does. Caltrain only has air rights from 0 to 30 feet.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11779154407024588438noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-57937937007128812822015-08-31T22:03:51.358-07:002015-08-31T22:03:51.358-07:00@Nathanael
Note that the shinkansen uses 1250mm pl...@Nathanael<br />Note that the shinkansen uses 1250mm platforms.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12341201158832109978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-54779137484973238422015-08-31T10:27:24.233-07:002015-08-31T10:27:24.233-07:00Caltrain have unutilized asset of SF terminal land...Caltrain have unutilized asset of SF terminal lands and should be use for cost of electrification. There are 12 tracks of station just for 5 train/h. (Each track utilize once every 2.5 hours)<br />As we know, BART terminal (Fremont and Richmond) have only 2 tracks but handles 8 train/h turn-around plus some coupling/decoupling.<br />I suggest SF terminal to shrink 2~3 tracks but with wider platform. Rest of space should be sold for redevelopment and those money to pay the electrification. <br />Train storage will be Bayshore 4-track section, Milbrae platform 5s and/or Redwood junction. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-14664598350234471782015-08-30T11:54:58.685-07:002015-08-30T11:54:58.685-07:00Starting in the late 1990's, Caltrain got a hu...Starting in the late 1990's, Caltrain got a huge amount of funding to purchase new railcars and rebuild many of the stations/platforms. It was very much a "big bang" type project, complete with weekend shutdowns that went on for two fucking years, just for some track/signal work.<br /><br />What we got out of that was dozens of Gallery car junkheaps, and more 8" platforms. They could have (and should have) coordinated the railcar order and platform rebuilds to provide level-platform boarding. <br /><br />So no, lack of money has nothing to do with it. The fact that they have since gone on to waste money on CBOSS is just icing on the cake.Drunk Engineerhttp://systemicfailure.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-51214049846963384802015-08-30T10:41:15.837-07:002015-08-30T10:41:15.837-07:00Yes, PTC is hard. So is building a good car. Tha...Yes, PTC is hard. So is building a good car. That's why you buy that sort of thing from people that have figured it out already.<br /><br />What business does Caltrain have using (blowing) OUR money on re-inventing the wheel vs. doing something worthwhile like raising platforms, etc.?Reality Checkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06974156676436895262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-89178112878724351382015-08-30T09:06:42.743-07:002015-08-30T09:06:42.743-07:00Other than pointing out that PTC is hard, and that...Other than pointing out that PTC is hard, and that Caltrain simply got in over its head with CBOSS, none. Also, we don't KNOW how much electrification is going to cost, the bids could easily come in well under Caltrain's estimates. Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-19141564546788021562015-08-30T02:44:01.620-07:002015-08-30T02:44:01.620-07:00Aside from figurative lobotomies, what specifc dis...Aside from figurative lobotomies, what specifc disagreements do you have with Richard's assessment?Reality Checkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06974156676436895262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-68841739156958158062015-08-30T00:09:59.020-07:002015-08-30T00:09:59.020-07:00Cool beans, so the only reason someone might disag...Cool beans, so the only reason someone might disagree with your assessment is because they've had a lobotomy? Your life must be very empty to have to resort to insults on the internet. Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-61289397516025599932015-08-29T14:53:55.976-07:002015-08-29T14:53:55.976-07:00"EVERYTHING to do with the fact that they'..."<i>EVERYTHING to do with the fact that they're struggling for funding</i>"<br /><br />Stop the bullshit.<br /><br />Caltrain has had the money to rebuilt nearly every single platform up and down the line to heights they KNEW were incompatible with EVERY type of level boarding.<br /><br />Caltrain has had the money to spend $250 million (officially, more like $325 to $375 million given the immense amount of stuff shifted onto other contracts) on simple resignalling of a 50 mile line.<br /><br />Caltrain has the money to spend 50% above the going rate for what should be simple standard mainline electrification of 50 route miles.<br /><br />Lack of money isn't the problem, and never has been. Caltrain is swimming in cash. Caltrain's contractors are laughing all the way to the bank, in fact all the way to the moon.<br /><br />I'm missing the connection between being forced to invent CBOSS and women's services, and between 20 years of not even planning for level boarding and care for the indigent.<br /><br />Having basic levels of social consciousness shouldn't <i>require</i> that you have a lobotomy and start defending transit-industrial crony capitalism while bleating about the Koch Brothers, but there sure seems a depressing level of correlation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-36819328054638694562015-08-29T08:04:21.098-07:002015-08-29T08:04:21.098-07:00"meanwhile in California"
Which has EVE..."meanwhile in California"<br /><br />Which has EVERYTHING to do with the fact that they're struggling for funding. Unlike in Germany, the federal government here is into cutting funding for services for women and the poor, and less into infrastructure improvements that make life better for everyone.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-33832742323258954032015-08-28T20:38:55.323-07:002015-08-28T20:38:55.323-07:00As I understand it, DB not only expanded the S-bah...As I understand it, DB not only expanded the S-bahn network and built new stations, but are also doing a whole new HSR connection to Berlin. Yeah, what a bunch of assholes those DB planners -- if the worst that can be said about the project is that older rolling stock is being temporarily used on some of the suburban lines, that hardly seems like a big drawback. Especially when that old rolling stock is still light years ahead of anything Caltrain is using.<br /><br />Peter: there is very much an implementation plan for 760mm platforms. The German Federal government is funding conversion for smaller stations (<1000 passengers), with a target date of 2018. According to press releases, the VRR has converted 3/4 of platforms, and has another $400 million Euros of station projects in the pipeline. Meanwhile in California: none of our commuter/intercity stations have level-boarding, and at the rate Caltrain is going they won't be done until the next milennium. Drunk Engineerhttp://systemicfailure.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-9009032078958362392015-08-28T17:21:31.156-07:002015-08-28T17:21:31.156-07:00Das Gras auf der anderen Seite... and all thatDas Gras auf der anderen Seite... and all thatClemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01374282217135682245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-86191698139781896952015-08-28T15:18:08.667-07:002015-08-28T15:18:08.667-07:00@Drunk Engineer:
Nope, those projects NEVER work. ...@Drunk Engineer:<br />Nope, those projects NEVER work. In Nuernberg, Germany (where I live), the S-Bahn network expanded a few years ago. Two old lines merged into one (S2), the other old line (S1) was extended to more than three times its original length and two new lines (S3+S4) were established. Of course, new EMU trainsets were bought, too, but their entry floor height was lower than that of the old trains and they were too long for the old platforms<br /><br />Today, the system looks as follows:<br />The S2 line still uses the old trains since all platforms are incompatible with the new trains. All old platforms served by the S1 line need to be lowered&extended because this line uses the new rolling stock. The S2 and S3 lines share tracks for a few miles, but the S3 trains don't stop at the stations because these are only compatible with the old trainsets used for the S2.<br /><br />This is what happens when everything is changed without careful planning...<br />And shit also happens in Europe...<br />And Caltrain planners work FAR FAR FAR better than the DB assholes who "planned" the new S-Bahn network Sebastiannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-77613655686055600912015-08-28T14:37:51.826-07:002015-08-28T14:37:51.826-07:00Yes, that old GG Bridge wind chestnut frequently g...Yes, that old GG Bridge wind chestnut frequently gets trotted out in connection with BART's track gauge.<br /><br />I doubt GG Bridge service would in any way ameliorate complaints about BART's track gauge today.<br /><br />If on the truly very rare occasion winds are high enough to make standard gauge BART unsafe, you wouldn't risk running broad gauge BART either.Reality Checkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06974156676436895262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-85153443198950829892015-08-28T14:14:33.374-07:002015-08-28T14:14:33.374-07:00Gallery cars have a floor height of 45".Gallery cars have a floor height of 45".Clemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01374282217135682245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-26872411214172288332015-08-28T14:02:24.096-07:002015-08-28T14:02:24.096-07:00Caltrain should consider raise the platform height...Caltrain should consider raise the platform height to 50 inch even before the electrification. Gallery car can be convert to 50" floor height by covering the steps. Caltrain also demonstrated Cab-Coach-Locomototive-Coach-Cab configuration. <br />So, platform can be partially (2 or 3 cars long) converted to 50" first with G(Gallery)Cab- GCoach - Locomotive -B(Bombardia)coach - Bcab configuration. Then, fully convert to 50" after the electrification. During the conversion, all EMU need to operate short consist but run twice the frequency to offset the capacity. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com