tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post1033680752692633192..comments2024-03-25T08:35:51.364-07:00Comments on Caltrain HSR Compatibility Blog: Keep Out the Coast DaylightClemhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01374282217135682245noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-6557915040798296792013-03-16T10:50:30.463-07:002013-03-16T10:50:30.463-07:00You're assuming that UPRR's business profi...You're assuming that UPRR's business profit maximization motive is always in <i>running freight trains</i>.<br /><br />Think about it!<br /><br />Fact: the "public" (meaning contractor puppet) agencies have made one thing unambiguously, crystal clear over the decades, and without any possible question since Altamont was killed, and that thing is "<b>cost is no object</b>".<br /><br />"Holding out for more money" is, without a doubt, the correct and guaranteed to pay off business strategy for a company with real state holdings, just as "collude to drive costs through the roof" is the correct strategy for local rail engineering, civil engineering and construction companies.<br /><br />UP is being perfectly rational and acting in its shareholder interests.<br />CSHRA and PCJPB are also acting perfectly on behalf of private interests.<br />Everybody is a winner!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-70921016927084484452013-03-15T15:07:14.703-07:002013-03-15T15:07:14.703-07:00really? I mean the freight traffic within that ROW...really? I mean the freight traffic within that ROW is infrequent compared to their line that serves the Central ValleyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-68710759244728381562013-03-15T11:13:18.819-07:002013-03-15T11:13:18.819-07:00Because they have no financial incentive to do oth...Because they have no financial incentive to do otherwise. Getting paid for a few FRA-compliant trains per day to run makes sense, but once you get higher frequencies, or try to run non-compliant trains, you begin seriously disrupting freight traffic.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-7097618171588185032013-03-14T22:47:40.567-07:002013-03-14T22:47:40.567-07:00How come UPRR is so stingy with their tracks, even...How come UPRR is so stingy with their tracks, even the less-used lines like the Los Angeles-San Jose track that the existing Surfliner and Coast Starlight use?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-62670869740983058532013-03-14T10:30:29.475-07:002013-03-14T10:30:29.475-07:00passenger cars to be used in the middle of freight...passenger cars to be used in the middle of freight trains*XANhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09931117537443848066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-4892353867901559152013-03-14T10:29:14.473-07:002013-03-14T10:29:14.473-07:00Russian bi-levels are the same overweighted s**t a...Russian bi-levels are the same overweighted s**t as American one. But in USA that was caused by an idea of "safe" train, while in Russia it was made to allow passenger trains to be used in the middle of freight trains (e.g. trains for military and rescue personnel+machinery)XANhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09931117537443848066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-61464940196287005462013-03-13T21:08:47.855-07:002013-03-13T21:08:47.855-07:00Here's how the pacific coast rail corridor wou...Here's how the pacific coast rail corridor would look like if improvements were made (i.e. electrification)<br /><br />https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202278891749402454243.0004d12e3f5eee0b54b45&msa=0 (Chatsworth to San Diego) <br />https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202278891749402454243.0004d05a409c105244413&msa=0 <br />(Chatsworth to SFO) <br />https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=202278891749402454243.0004cfb056b5034a7b9b2&msa=0 (Bay Area)<br /><br />Also to mention, how this bi-level railcar. (links: http://www.modelena.ru/tiporazmer_HO/podvignoy_sostav/bachmann_2011/passvag/e202.jpg, http://www.yaplakal.com/pics/pics_original/7/0/0/274007.jpg, http://www.yaplakal.com/forum2/topic282799.html, http://trs-msts.ru/index.php?do=photo&a=showphoto&photoid=175; http://kvisaz.ru/files//2011/01/15-bilevel-rail-car-russian-61-4465.jpg (new bi-level), http://www.hebners.net/amtrak/amtSUPER/amt32501.jpg (Superliner)) This design is from Russia and looks similar and functions identically to the Superliner series and has high level platforming. The only changes that are made are to re-gauge it to standard gauge.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-54439461746574816472013-03-12T01:06:14.894-07:002013-03-12T01:06:14.894-07:00I don't think these are unresolvable problems....I don't think these are unresolvable problems. The lateness problem should only be an issue with north bound trains arriving into Diridon late that got stuck behind hopper cars filled with tomatoes somewhere along the coast route between Gilroy and LA. Caltrain just needs to enforce it's schedule like airports manage take-off slots.<br /><br />Caltrain could designate time slots N.B. Coast Daylights would be allowed to depart Diridon (ex: 5:05, 6:05, 7:05 ect.). If the 5:05 train was late by any amount it would wait in the station until 6:05 to depart. Amtrak would then notify their passengers of the delay and inform them they can transfer to any of the Caltrain's that will be departing in the meantime. Amtrak could negotiate with Caltrain to accept Daylight tickets as Caltrain fare. Otherwise the passengers would be free to stay on the Daylight and accept the fact they may arrive exactly 1 hour late. Therefore regardless of how late the Daylight is it would need to adhere to allocated time slots in Caltrain's schedule.<br /><br />The less station stops the Daylight makes on the peninsula, the less issue with differing platform heights (assuming Caltrain changes to high platforms). I am guessing Palo Alto might be the one and only peninsula stop for the Daylight. If Palo Alto had high platforms couldn't they build secondary low platforms along the same tracks just south of the primary platforms (adjacent to the station parking on both sides of the tracks)? Extend the platforms a bit further south and they could also make use of the pedestrian under-crossing at the end of Homer. There would be no problems accommodating a few low level platforms at Diridon and in SF the Daylight could terminate at 4th & King which could keep a few low level platforms as well.<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-86913766675783533582013-02-14T19:32:31.826-08:002013-02-14T19:32:31.826-08:00It's already eight via the Central Valley. Al...It's already eight via the Central Valley. All you need to do is spend the money on double tracking Tehachapi rather than on whatever improvements UP would almost certainly require along the coast.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-74111809431449622022013-02-14T17:14:00.037-08:002013-02-14T17:14:00.037-08:00Precisely.Precisely.Clemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01374282217135682245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-53550241324897036852013-02-14T16:08:08.550-08:002013-02-14T16:08:08.550-08:00Just have the Coast Daylight either terminate in S...Just have the Coast Daylight either terminate in SJ or OAK. There will be at least one FRA dinosaur platform track going through Diridon, just keep the damn thing off the main Caltrain corridor north of Diridon.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-34412543219031510782013-02-13T21:58:02.171-08:002013-02-13T21:58:02.171-08:00Yeah, twelve hours is just too slow. Get it down ...Yeah, twelve hours is just too slow. Get it down to eight, and maybe with a one hour turnaround, you can utilize the trainset for the return trip, rather than a costly layover.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-24758224169958510872013-02-13T20:35:47.246-08:002013-02-13T20:35:47.246-08:00So I get up at 4am to get to LA by 5pm? Wow. Just ...So I get up at 4am to get to LA by 5pm? Wow. Just wow...Michaelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-92223000193904098902013-02-13T20:26:19.361-08:002013-02-13T20:26:19.361-08:00Frankly, I’m appalled at the lack of imagination o...Frankly, I’m appalled at the lack of imagination on this topic. Is the route slow? Yes. Does it need upgrades? You bet. Does every route need to be a speeding bullet? Not at all! Some people actually want to be on a train for a good part of the day. The Daylight will provide an alternative to the Valley based HSR route. Another positive is that in the future, passenger service will return to the Santa Cruz Branch—producing a true passenger network around the Bay Area and the rest of Northern California. <br /><br />Some logical solutions:<br />1. Daylight: #798 leaves SF at 0520, arrives in LA 1700; #799 dp LA 0905, ar SF 1935<br />2. Starlight: #11 operates six hours later than its current schedule; #14 dp LA 1625, dp Emeryville 0407, ar SEA 0245<br />3. New route would operate on Starlight’s current schedule north of SAC but south of the capital city, the trains would actually traverse the San Joaquin route and serve Valley cities enroute to LA<br />4. Standalone Shasta route between SJ and POR would serve daytime passengers<br />5. Track upgrades on the Coast Route would then make travel times faster<br />6. Additional frequencies on the Daylight route means SF-LA passengers would have three roundtrips on the scenic route <br />7. Engines: Either conventional routes like the Daylight would switch over to electric engines or they would terminate at Caltrain’s 4th Street Station<br />The Rail Enthusiasthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08716370779057151520noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-46147033921828644442013-02-12T22:13:10.094-08:002013-02-12T22:13:10.094-08:00In its current condition, the Coast Line is not we...In its current condition, the Coast Line is not well suited for Bay Area - LA trips. It is suited for intermediate trips. Maybe more SLO -> LA and Bay Area trips are the answer. More logically, Paso Robles -> Bay Area, as the trip over the Cuesta Grade is SSSSLLLLLLOOOOOWWWW. <br /><br />Do the studies or entities promoting the CoastDaylight know what the market is? As I understand the proposed schedule, it's like an hour or two off the existing Starlight schedule. What if trains from SLO went north and south to fulfill trips into SF and LA in the early morning? Who is the market for the Daylight? Michaelnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-77454440721164139422013-02-12T16:43:38.804-08:002013-02-12T16:43:38.804-08:00I don't understand why Amtrak California NEEDS...I don't understand why Amtrak California NEEDS a "Coast Daylight". It has one. Just because the through train is called the "Coast STARlight" doesn't mean it's a night train for its entire trip. From Jack London to LAUPT the schedule is Depart 8:50 AM, Arrive 9:00 PM. For LAUPT to Jack London it's Depart 9:25 AM, Arrive 9:32 PM. <br /><br />As is pointed out above, the Coast Line has few freights; they're mostly pickup and delivery locals. There just isn't much of a market for Bay Area to LA rail freight; they're close enough via I-5 that trucks can make the run with one driver departing early in the morning and delivering before end of business the same day. <br /><br />So the <b>northbound</b> Starlight is pretty darn reliable; all it has to worry about are MetroLink and Surfliners which also run on a schedule. The southbound, not so much, though there is quite a bit of pad in the schedule south of Redding. <br /><br />The point is, this train would be redundant. And Amtrak California already tried an overnighter; <i>that</i> was a fiasco and ended in less than two years. This proposal should have already been killed; it's probably on the table simply because nobody with any authority has thought it serious enough to oppose it. <br /><br />Anandakoshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15397105362372268883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-16057707407526314652013-02-12T13:56:05.760-08:002013-02-12T13:56:05.760-08:00The problem with this whole discussion is that nei...The problem with this whole discussion is that neither the Coast Daylight nor the HSR actually exist. They're both still at the purely imaginary stage, and while the Daylight is allegedly only a year or two out, it's been a year or two out for a while now. Still, if it actually does start running, it would be a good decade or two earlier than HSR, especially HSR that actualy reaches the Bay Area, and probably a couple years before Caltrain electrification (which itself has been 5 years away for as long as I've been in the Bay Area). There's nothing wrong with diverting the Daylight from SF to Oakland once it's no longer possible to run it on the Caltrain line. Also, I suppose I should point that the East Rail in Hong Kong runs a much more intensive service than Caltrain, yet still manages to mix in intercity service, including long-distance sleeper trains, and at one point even had freight service.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-39170601009789271982013-02-12T13:11:44.537-08:002013-02-12T13:11:44.537-08:00No, I'm simply pointing out that there's a...No, I'm simply pointing out that there's a latent market on the corridor. We'd need a pilot to see if it can be viably tapped.Steve Stofkahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14825368520377993845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-83077726357211008412013-02-12T10:38:19.481-08:002013-02-12T10:38:19.481-08:00The worst delays are up near the CA-Oregon border ...The worst delays are up near the CA-Oregon border but none of it's particularly reliable, and UPRR has little interest in improving Amtrak service.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-34196028528263432002013-02-12T05:03:44.253-08:002013-02-12T05:03:44.253-08:00The problem is that UP is not going to allow Talgo...The problem is that UP is not going to allow Talgos to be used at full speed, let alone Pendolini. BNSF, a generally passenger rail-friendlier operator, restricts the Talgos on the Cascades to 5" cant deficiency, the same as a non-tilting Amfleet on the NEC.Alonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17267294744186811858noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-46753937724372493562013-02-11T22:26:39.986-08:002013-02-11T22:26:39.986-08:00Coast Daylight- agree keep it off Caltrain/HSR tra...Coast Daylight- agree keep it off Caltrain/HSR tracks- it will be a concession /tourist train mainly serving pax in intermediate cities (like the San Joaquins) and people with time on their hands- so a transfer at San Jose or Oakland/Emeryville is acceptable for those needing to get to SF/peninsula destinations. Since the Coast Line doesn't see many freights, timekeeping should be better than on the much longer Starlight.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-17994009992359570252013-02-11T20:35:50.938-08:002013-02-11T20:35:50.938-08:00Lets step back and relax a bit.
1) What is the c...Lets step back and relax a bit. <br /><br />1) What is the current status of the Coast Daylight? Not running.<br /><br />2) How much significant political effort is behind it? <br /><br />3) How much more likely is it to run to SF? In the grand scheme the Coast Daylight could really be the Coast Starlight offset by 12 hours?<br /><br />4) Why pick a battle with other train advocates?<br /><br />This whole non-problem becomes even less of a non-problem if the Coast Starlight becomes a twice a day train following the same route up to Seattle. Patrick Moorehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03497011978518651516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-90811383107429361102013-02-11T20:07:06.946-08:002013-02-11T20:07:06.946-08:00Clem: you persist in assuming that CalTrain will h...Clem: you persist in assuming that CalTrain will have level boarding -- despite Caltrain having no plans for level boarding, now or in the future?<br /><br />Which do you think will happen sooner: Caltrain planning for level boarding, or Republicans acknowledging anthropogenic global climate change?<br />kiwi.jonathanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18215458981556481196noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-65345171559822782962013-02-11T17:09:50.563-08:002013-02-11T17:09:50.563-08:00You're conflating "covers the coastal cor...You're conflating "covers the coastal corridor" (dubious in itself) with "important" (most assuredly not) and with "viable" (most certainly not).Richard Mlynarikhttp://www.pobox.com/users/mly/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8419444332771213285.post-32534612829416016912013-02-11T16:18:05.285-08:002013-02-11T16:18:05.285-08:00As it turns out, the coast route isn't even a ...As it turns out, the coast route isn't even a good way for conventional trains to get from the Bay Area to LA. Taking the San Joaquin to Bakersfield and then transferring to a bus saves you nearly 4 hours on Oakland-LA compared to the Starlight. If you're going to put in the money for additional service in the short-medium term, might as well spend it to finish doubling the Tehachapi line (could probably get a bunch of the money to do so from UP and BNSF too). Plus it would make the ICS marginally more useful, though running 32t/axel locomotives over new high speed track is probably a bad idea to begin with.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.com